right like.... i feel like that's the cause of at least 70% of the social isolation aura bc the only way men know how to socialise is to be oot and aboot on the bevvies. i feel like there are some guys like ... idk random example but eg. natmac who if they wanted to, could enjoy themselves to the fullest due to generally being an Extreme Personality, but they've decided on ascetic monklike dedication and to Willingly Make Sacrifices for the Cause. meanwhile jrob's vibe is like Well beer gives me a schtummy ache anyway it's not that big of a deal. definitely there's a sacrifice aspect to it but it just seems more like natural personality tendency more than repressive self-policing? maybe it's so enthralling exactly bc it has more ambiguity and isnt as clearcut as the tightly wound martyr act LOL